TSSP: List Archives

From: boris petkovic
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 10:55:01 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: [TSSP] Top Voltage


Hi Paul,  

> I had in mind that the various factors that have
> been mentioned
> might combine to drop the breakout field quite a way
> below 26kV/cm,
> say down to 12 or 13 kV/cm.
---
I would hardly imagine something like that in
mentioned magnitude.I think (this doesn't necessary
mean that I'm 100 % correct) wild variations in
temperature,moisture , air pressure,content ( etc,etc)
are required for such things.What I agree with is that
breakout voltage may vary ,but this is another thing.
Notch rise times (k) and difference in polarities
between successive rf semicycles might be also
important factors (IMO ,more important than decay rf
cycles in low Q OLTC secondary).All TBD things.
---       
> 
> But with the sphere in place, and Terry reporting
> 190kV, that
> puts us back to the original observation:  the
> sphere is not
> breaking out until much higher than software
> predicts.
---
But <50% discrepacy is within reach.That is not that
bad.Breakout events are stohastic in nature and
something like +- 10% correlation for every shoot is
illusion to be ever achieved.
---   
> 
> 
> I remodelled this low sphere to predict a breakout
> voltage
> of 120kV, based on 26kV/cm.   The 190kV breakout
> translates
> to a breakdown field of 42 kV/cm.
---
Has he experimented with "higher positioned" sphere
(say 1 feet+ above toroid)  and still no breakout with
180-190 kV?Sorry for asking that but I haven't read
all tssp post details yet.  
---

> Maybe the software's wrong.  It reproduces tabulated
> 
> sphere-sphere breakdown voltages reasonably well,
> and the
> surface field strengths from which these are
> calculated are
> a free by-product of the cap calculations.  If the
> field was
> wrong, so would the caps be too.  Maybe I've got the
> average
> surface charge correct (so the cap is right) but the
> minima
> and maxima are a way out?  The software searches for
> the
> location of highest surface field and goes off that.
---
Profound questions.You would better know to
investigate software pecularities since you are the
author.How about trying to use E-tesla for gotten
structure voltage profile?
---
> Is the breakout threshold much higher than we expect
> when
> we're only dealing with a very few RF half cycles
> repeated
> every 100mS?
--
As some experimental observation suggest,for 300 kHz
high k single pulse TC systems the threshold could be
more than 2X higher (compared with 28 kV/cm).For 38
kHz OLTC the effect of corona formative time lags 
shouldn't be that large I guess.
--- 


> 
> Boris wrote:
> > If so,Terry improved OLTC secondary Q (or it was
> > improved by itself) and can do somewhat better by
> > changing k factor to see how rise time effect
> > breakout.
> 
> Yes, or maybe put the small sphere on a CW coil as
> the only
> top terminal.  The breakout voltages could then be
> determined
> (eg by measuring base current) and we could easily
> test if this
> changes as a function of burst length and burst
> rate.
> 
> Note that with breakout voltages this far out from
> the expected
> values, there's no immediate pressure to setup a
> topvolts probe.
> A measure of Ibase is more than adequate to estimate
> Vtop.
> --
If Terry can run OLTC secondary in CW mode somehow
(remember Q=80 now)  ,than excellent.Few seconds of CW
run wouldn't do any harm to the secondary,but again it
is him to decide.

regards,
Boris    

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